RPMs bounce, SES, VDC OFF, and SLIP lights on and engine stalls - Crankshaft and Camshaft Position Sensors!!!

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Swerve
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RPMs bounce, SES, VDC OFF, and SLIP lights on and engine stalls - Crankshaft and Camshaft Position Sensors!!!

Postby Swerve » Thu Mar 31, 2022 10:20 am

I had this experience last year on warm summer days. Driving along at whatever speed, RPMs needle on the Tachometer would drop, then bounce back up to normal with a blip of dropped engine power. This would happen once in a while on 45 min or longer drives and only sometimes. Weeks go by without any incident. As my problem started to increase in frequency, the RPMs would drop, bounce back up, and then began to oscillate up and down with reduced power, or it would some times jump around from 0 to 3000 very quickly as if it was possessed, with erratic engine power drops and surges as I'd be pumping the gas pedal to get out of this RPM limbo. Then the Service Engine Soon light came on, and seconds later the VDC OFF and SLIP lights. A hat trick of warnings at whatever speed, 20MPH or over 50MPH and then the engine would STALL while still doing 50 MPH! Scary as hell as you have 1 press of the brake pedal for power assisted braking to pull over and stop on the shoulder IF there's a shoulder. Some cars have a limp home mode, where the engine runs at reduced power and speed so at least you can safely get the car off the road/back home in a safe manner. Not our pathy. Engine stalls out, 0 RPM at 50 MPH. :shock:

Pull over, turn off. wait 20 seconds, restart engine- no more lights and runs fine for the rest of the trip. Get the Pathy scanned and NO CODES are stored. No fault found and nothing to fix!?!?!

Issue reoccurs again days/weeks later on another trip up, this time up the mountain to Whistler, BC. RPMs drop and bounce, lights come on, engine stalls out, and I pull over. Restart and the lights are off and running normal again, but this time only for a few minutes at a time. This happens a bunch of times until FINALLY the Service Engine Soon light stays on. I got up the mountain, but only half way back down as it got too frequent that I had little confidence I could continue safely with all these engine stalls at speed, and lack of shoulders on the Sea to Sky highway to pull over too. It's also downhill and without power assisted brakes for more than 1 press with a stalled engine, it could be catastrophic, so we had it towed back home for just over $300 as we were still about an hour away. Get it scanned and it's code P0335 CKP SEN/CIRCUIT - a failing Crankshaft Position Sensor, part number:
23731-EA20D (replaces 23731-EA20C) List price 104.62CAD in stock at the dealer. D replaced C. Did C replace B? how many revisions of this sensor have there been? In stock at the dealer so it's common enough a problem I'd say.

After this it was fine for a couple months until the fall when I was coasting slowly through a school zone at minimal RPM and it just stalled instantly. Turn it off, reassure the wife I'll get it fixed again, restart engine, SES light is on. Get scanned and this time it's code P0340 CMP SEN/CIRC-B1 - a failed Camshaft Position Sensor, but I replaced both sides. Dealer has these in stock too and didn't need to order these in at all so clearly they see enough volume.

23731-6J90E (replaces B) List 212.40 CAD
23731-AL61D (replaces A) List 216.67 CAD

Interestingly, one of these cam sensors has a plastic end to the sensor while another has a metal end. The originals that came out of my truck were both plastic ended, so I guess one got updated with a metal end as the plastic wasn't holding up maybe. Who knows.

My Pathy had 150K KM/ 93K Miles when I dealt with this last summer and fall. It's been fine since. If you're around this mileage and haven't had these issues yet, don't wait for them to emerge. It's a scary situation to have your family loaded up and have your engine stall out while doing 50MPH on a single lane mountain highway with very few shoulders you can pull over into and 1 press of that brake pedal to stop the damn thing. Don't wait to react to when this happens, or hope yours are fine and mine were just defective and that I had bad luck, or cling on to 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it'. Be proactive and add this into your next maintenance, and have peace of mind that your next road trip won't be messed up because of these damn sensors.

REPLACE your CRANKSHAFT POSITION SENSOR and CAMSHAFT POSITION SENSORS.


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Wahooo
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Re: RPMs bounce, SES, VDC OFF, and SLIP lights on and engine stalls - Crankshaft and Camshaft Position Sensors!!!

Postby Wahooo » Thu Apr 07, 2022 3:36 pm

Adding Crankshaft position sensor to my upcoming tune up.

silverarrow27
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Re: RPMs bounce, SES, VDC OFF, and SLIP lights on and engine stalls - Crankshaft and Camshaft Position Sensors!!!

Postby silverarrow27 » Thu Apr 07, 2022 4:52 pm

Definitely a nice thread. Thanks for your finding!

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smj999smj
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Re: RPMs bounce, SES, VDC OFF, and SLIP lights on and engine stalls - Crankshaft and Camshaft Position Sensors!!!

Postby smj999smj » Tue Apr 12, 2022 2:03 pm

It's odd that one of those replacement cam sensors was plastic and the other had a metal end. Both of them are the updated part number and should have the metal end type cam sensors. Maybe someone switched them out? Anyway, the metal end was added to the sensor to help protect it from some of the heat. I've seen both types fail, so I'm not sure how much of a benefit is is? My 2006 still has its original cam and crank position sensors after 225K miles and my 08 with 275K miles has only had the left bank cam position sensor replaced. $212 CA (about $167 US) is a lot of money to spend on a cam sensor! I would suffice with Hitachi cam sensors from Rockauto @ $40 US ea.

When it comes to changes...or "superseded" part numbers...it doesn't always mean the part was updated. That "could be" the case, but Nissan supersedes part numbers for a variety of reasons. It could be due to a change in manufacturer of the part or even where the part was made and sometimes for reasons of which nobody is quite sure!

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Wahooo
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Re: RPMs bounce, SES, VDC OFF, and SLIP lights on and engine stalls - Crankshaft and Camshaft Position Sensors!!!

Postby Wahooo » Thu Apr 14, 2022 4:43 pm

20220414_183909.jpg
These are the Hitachi Cam Position Sensors I got from Rock Auto a couple of weeks ago, both plastic.
Crank Position Sensor plastic also.

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smj999smj
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Re: RPMs bounce, SES, VDC OFF, and SLIP lights on and engine stalls - Crankshaft and Camshaft Position Sensors!!!

Postby smj999smj » Fri Apr 15, 2022 9:35 pm

The only sensors I'm aware of that have the metal ends are the ones that come from Nissan.

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Swerve
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Re: RPMs bounce, SES, VDC OFF, and SLIP lights on and engine stalls - Crankshaft and Camshaft Position Sensors!!!

Postby Swerve » Fri Apr 22, 2022 12:32 pm

smj999smj wrote:
Tue Apr 12, 2022 2:03 pm
It's odd that one of those replacement cam sensors was plastic and the other had a metal end. Both of them are the updated part number and should have the metal end type cam sensors. Maybe someone switched them out? Anyway, the metal end was added to the sensor to help protect it from some of the heat. I've seen both types fail, so I'm not sure how much of a benefit is is? My 2006 still has its original cam and crank position sensors after 225K miles and my 08 with 275K miles has only had the left bank cam position sensor replaced. $212 CA (about $167 US) is a lot of money to spend on a cam sensor! I would suffice with Hitachi cam sensors from Rockauto @ $40 US ea.

When it comes to changes...or "superseded" part numbers...it doesn't always mean the part was updated. That "could be" the case, but Nissan supersedes part numbers for a variety of reasons. It could be due to a change in manufacturer of the part or even where the part was made and sometimes for reasons of which nobody is quite sure!
yes, it was weird that one cam sensor was metal and the other plastic ended but they were new in package nissan parts, and they're working ok. I'd be happy with Hitachi too but didn't want to wait. the crank sensor was also metal; here's the old one on the left and the new metal one on the right.
Attachments
crank sensor.jpg

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palmerwmd
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Re: RPMs bounce, SES, VDC OFF, and SLIP lights on and engine stalls - Crankshaft and Camshaft Position Sensors!!!

Postby palmerwmd » Fri May 20, 2022 4:07 am

Just had to get both replaced.

First it was the right bank only .. then 2 months later he left side went too.


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