Has anyone done 4600 Bilstein front and rear?

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ShipFixer
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Postby ShipFixer » Sun May 31, 2020 7:03 pm

vegpower wrote:Hey, I haven't changed the sway bar bushings. They look okay to me.
Does the rubber loses its properties? like it gets stiffer?

I prefer to mute the feedback from the road at this point )))

So rubber bushing would be the way to go in that case for what I gather.

I haven't been able to do serious off road yet to notice if the rear bottoms out

cheers!
What smj says, but also to answer your questions, the rubber gets softer over time where polyurethane stays stiffer for longer. A stiffer sway bar bushing means the car is more resistant to body roll in turns. It does not mean a harsher ride.

A brand new rubber bushing and a brand new poly bushing feel about the same, but the rubber doesn't feel the same nearly as long.


vegpower
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Postby vegpower » Sun May 31, 2020 11:31 pm

I see thanks, mine is a 2008 V8.

vegpower
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Postby vegpower » Mon Jun 01, 2020 6:29 pm

I've changed all 4 sway bar links, one was broken, the driving dynamics are improving considerably.

Also I got rid of some noise, but I can still feel some.

I ordered sway bar bushings for front and rear.

Let's see how it goes!

TooMuchControl
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Re: Has anyone done 4600 Bilstein front and rear?

Postby TooMuchControl » Fri Jun 26, 2020 4:54 pm

I've done the Bilsteins front and rear.
I have Yokohama Geolander tires.

I was expecting much of these shocks, honestly. They seem to "crash-bang" on simple road bumps on my street at low speeds. On the highway, they ride very good, but all shocks should? I've gone over some good bumps on the highway with Bills and I'm not impressed enough to say that they swallow bumps. There is good stability, though.

I've just purchased a set of KYB struts to challenge my opinion and will be installing them in the next week.
I've also purchased new sway bar links and bushings for the front and rear.

I'm going to swap out the links and bushings this weekend to see how the response is from the Bilstein setup.
Next weekend I'm going to swap out the front with KYB and install new springs with them (AC Delco).
I have also purchase new rear trailing control arms, and will be installing the new AC Delco variable rate springs in the rear next weekend. My initial inspection found that those trailing arm bushings are worn, and could contribute a lot to the comfort level.

I'm hoping to
1. find a deficiency in one of the links and bushings, to provide me an AHA moment.
2. if I'don't find a deficiency, then I will want to find if the new links make a difference along with the bushings in ride quality.
3. after the links, then I'm onto the front struts. I will check the springs and Bilsteins to make sure that there isn't a deficiency between them that could cause another AHA moment.
4. whether I find a deficiency or not, I will be replacing the springs and adding the KYB struts and getting an alignment.
5. I had the OEM, then the Bilstein, and now back to trying newer KYB, so that I can really tell if there is a difference, as the Bills only have about 15k on them.

I'm hoping to find a step by step difference maker.
None of these parts cost a lost, and I was able to get OEM links and bushings for about $100, total, on ebay.
The springs I got on Amazon for $40 USD for the rear, and $45 USD for the front.
The struts, about $100 USD.


In a couple of weeks I will know if there is any difference, as I'm going to from Bills to KYB's either way. I have enough experience with my Bills to know if the KYBs are suitable, or worse.

vegpower
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Re: Has anyone done 4600 Bilstein front and rear?

Postby vegpower » Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:36 pm

Awesome man! let me know how that goes! I just picked up my truck from the shop and I am stoked! all the noises are gone and ride is way better! buttery smooth compared than before.

It is so hard to find a competent shop!

I got someone to change my rack and pinion bushings previously (he installed them wrong they said), but even so I felt reduced vibrations on the steering. Bushings are super pro polys btw.
They also retorqued many parts (sway bar links, sway bar bushings, they said there was a missing bushing on the struts, replaced tie rods, replaced a wheelbearing etc.)

I am really satisfied now with the truck, I always said I loved everything about this truck except for the ride...but not anymore!

I hope you get even better ride with the new KyB. let us know!

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ShipFixer
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Re: Has anyone done 4600 Bilstein front and rear?

Postby ShipFixer » Tue Jun 30, 2020 8:56 pm

TooMuchControl wrote:
Fri Jun 26, 2020 4:54 pm
In a couple of weeks I will know if there is any difference, as I'm going to from Bills to KYB's either way. I have enough experience with my Bills to know if the KYBs are suitable, or worse.
What springs do you have? If you still have the OEM springs in the rear, and no air bags, there will still be a lot of crash and bang with any shock to be honest. My truck did not get better until I put air bags in.

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NWPathfinder
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Re: Has anyone done 4600 Bilstein front and rear?

Postby NWPathfinder » Wed Jul 01, 2020 10:20 am

I put the Bilstein 4600's in the back as mine were done. Pretty sure they were they originals, the housings were all rusty and I actually ended up getting some under the nail which netted me a Hospital Visit. Anyways, I digress, the I put the 4600's in and the MOOG 81119 Springs in as i wanted a little more stability and strength in case we decide to tow something.

What a ride difference! Way more firm in the back. Now I have to tackle the front as it still seems a bit unsettled up front. Sadly I have to order all of this stuff online as nobody up in Canada stocks Bilstein or MOOG. I was just going to go MOOG Quick Strut in the front but, wondering if I should keep Bilstein all round??

Anyways, pretty easy job, just tedious with the tiny spaces. Did the rear brakes while I was at it too. Love the feeling of new brakes!

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ShipFixer
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Re: Has anyone done 4600 Bilstein front and rear?

Postby ShipFixer » Wed Jul 01, 2020 11:05 am

Yeah - the Moog springs are just a touch firmer in the front, but equal in the back and brings the truck much, much more in balance. The frequency response of the rear is now pretty close to perfect thanks to the Moogs. I'm pretty sure if the trucks had been made this way then they'd still be selling really well, I have yet to test drive anything I like better than mine in a 2020 model and I don't think these springs and shocks are significantly more expensive than the OEM KYB's. But in retrospect...I think the OEM ride setup was hot garbage, and my truck only had 28K miles on it when I got it. The rear end really, really punished the front end for stability.

I am pretty sure the Moog quick strut fronts will either be the same KYB OEM shock or a very similar copy. I would stick with Bilstein for an improvement if you can.

Since a strut compressor is usually a controlling function here, for not much more than the cost of the quick struts you can get the Moog front springs, Bilstein HD's, and a strut mount kit aftermarket, then get the spring perches from Nissan. Have a shop put all that together for you, and then it's an easy swap in the driveway. I got polyurethane strut mount bushings and whatnot but I don't think that's necessary.

vegpower
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Re: Has anyone done 4600 Bilstein front and rear?

Postby vegpower » Fri Jul 03, 2020 7:19 pm

Hey man, what do exactly the airbags in the rear improve?

Prevent springs from bottoming out off road?

Do they improve ride comfort at all on the highway, over speed bumps :P or on roads in bad condition?

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Code Pathfinder
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Re: Has anyone done 4600 Bilstein front and rear?

Postby Code Pathfinder » Fri Jul 03, 2020 8:52 pm

Airbags in the rear coil springs prevent squat or swaying while towing. I have them installed on my rig since I have custom tire carrier on the back with a 33 inch tire on it.

I run my bags anywhere between 10-20 PSI depending on if I am towing something or not.

vegpower
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Re: Has anyone done 4600 Bilstein front and rear?

Postby vegpower » Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:26 pm

I see, I don't tow so...


Thanks!

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ShipFixer
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Re: Has anyone done 4600 Bilstein front and rear?

Postby ShipFixer » Sat Jul 04, 2020 12:31 am

I don't tow either, I just want my truck to drive as close to a big car as I can make it most days 8)

With the stock springs, they will make up for the weak rear OEM springs and yes, improve your ride. I ran 5-10 psi in mine unloaded, and up to 25-30 psi with people and a heavy bike rack. My rear springs no longer bottomed out over dumb things on the highway during normal driving, and it no longer upset the front end. The primary reason people get Airlift bags is for load leveling (particularly during towing), but the OEM spec here is just so soft it makes a huge difference for this truck.

With the Moog springs I put a new set of Airlift 1000 springs in there for load leveling. But I run them at 0 psi, the ride is now "correct" without the assist.

You can visually tell if a Pathfinder has OEM springs and no Airlift bags on the highway from the way it wallows and sways in the rear :?

TooMuchControl
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Re: Has anyone done 4600 Bilstein front and rear?

Postby TooMuchControl » Sat Jul 04, 2020 4:07 pm

Update Part 1. Front Suspension

So. Lessons learned.....

New front sway bar bushings - OEM.
The sway bar, I could move it down, out of the way, by hand,when disconnecting the links. I thought that was normal...until I installed the new bushings. That sway bar will not pivot now with the new bushings in place. It is not meant to move easily. That's what you get with a 15 year old vehicle.

New front stabilizer links, with new OEM.
Lesson learned. Go with the OEM. I had Mevotech on them, and one of them was completely seized. The OEM ones are visually and physically superior. Worth every penny. Got them on ebay for $20 each.

Struts
Replaced the Bilsteins to the KYB struts. Umm - made in Japan KYB struts?
I'll take it. These have to be the actual OEM that came new with the truck.

Replaced the OEM springs and installed new ACDelco 45H0431. These new springs have two more coils per length that the OEM.

Inspected the strut mount rubber. Replaced with new KYB strut mount rubber kit. KYB SM5699 (x2) as recommended as part of new strut installations.


Update 2: Rear Suspension - Later
I will be performing the rear changeout (bushings, stabilizer links, variable rate springs) within the next week.

Observations of Front:

Didn't have the time to try a Bilstein to KYB comparison after the bushings, strut mounts and links.
My thoughts: the stronger AC Delco springs up front. Good idea by whoever thought of it.

The ride: unfair until I get the rear in order. I may find other worn parts when I get underneath there.

For now, I'm 100% certain the front ride is better, if not superior.

I need to drive for a couple of weeks on my usual routes to really have a feel for it. Convincing yourself something is better, because you bought it, would not be fair. I know which roads I clench my cheeks on, and which stretch of highway :shock: so it is an easy test to see how these changes handle the usual trips.

Lessons: Bushings bushings bushings. If sways are worn, which others?. (i.e. Control Arms).

Pity the mechanic that has to look under these older trucks and tell us what EXACTLY is wrong, without taking everything apart. If you find that Mechcanic, keep him for life.

Tool Impressions: Strut tool. Best purchase I have made in a quite awhile.
8MILELAKE MacPherson Strut Spring Compressor Interchangeable Fork Coil Extractor Set.

This tool makes short work of strut springs. Feels completely safe, and it cranks the coils with almost little effort. No need for an impact wrench. Aligns everything easily and works on small and large springs. A simple socket wrench on the end and it compresses strut springs with no effort. Everything else I've ever used from a Auto Parts store is complete junk compared to this thing.

vegpower
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Re: Has anyone done 4600 Bilstein front and rear?

Postby vegpower » Sat Jul 04, 2020 4:23 pm

I replaced rack and pinion bushings from this australian company "superpro" they reduced NVH by a 30 to 40%


https://www.suspension.com/products/nis ... r_4wd_2008

They have lots of high quality poly bushings!

Got curious about the air bags. What's the specific part number for them? AIR:60829?



Thanks


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